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Posts posted by Hawk

  1. Lexi77,

    If there is a hell, it sounds to me like several people in your story here have front row seats warming up for them. And it ISN'T your friend, you, his wife, or his sister. What kind of imperious ass would force such an issue, openly, at a family function? Was there nobody there with the gonads to stand up for your friend? It's a good thing I'm not in that family, and I wasn't at that function. They would not have considered it a joke by the time I was done with them. No one else in the family would have found any humor in it either. But, I'm not, and I wasn't.

    At any rate, your friend has NOTHING to be ashamed about. Not even the fact that he had sex with his cousin. Though it carries a stigma now, he has merely joined the billions of people throughout history who have done so. He has nothing to be ashamed about his parenting this child either, even if he had zero influence in her life. Once he found out his responsibility, he lived up to it. Her issues fall squarely on the shoulders of these wretched "parents" of hers. NOT her biological father.

    While this site isn't really quite the forum he needs, I'm not sure any place other than here would understand, and not make further sport of him. We do have tales of woe here. We have tales of families behaving badly toward their progeny all the time. We hear tales of cousins using and abusing their cousins. We remind our members often enough that cousins are people too, with all the flaws and neuroses of any other random human being out there. And even though he didn't have, or apparently want a relationship with his cousin, (as this forum is set up for) that doesn't mean he shouldn't come here and look around and realize that these situations do indeed end badly sometimes. He isn't the first by far to have a cousin with less than stellar behavior, or morals. If he would care to come here, we would do our best to convince him of that. Other than us, I'm not sure what other "group therapy" for someone in his situation that there would be. We would certainly do what we could to ease his mind, I'll assure you. Copy this and show him if he insists on not coming here, but let him know he's more than welcome to lurk if he wants to. I would chat with him, but, the site recently went through a major overhaul, and we ditched the chat room. If he does feel the need for feedback, he can post perfectly anonymously, and the guys and gals here will try to help him through all this drama....

  2. AshR,

    If you are both professionals, I take it you would have the luxury of mobility. I would take advantage of it.

      I would think you could move elsewhere, to a country where you would be allowed to marry. The parents are still going to wig out, but, if you capitulate, you can fully well expect them to continue to run your lives until the day they die. By then, there will be no going back for the two of you. I realize that in your culture, it is almost unheard of to make a clean break from your family. Almost as unheard of as a cousin relationship. But, if you two want to be together and be happy, to migrate to where you can do so is really the only option we here can, in good conscience, give to you. 

  3. Zach,

    Well, I stand by my advice so far then, and if her home State isn't an option, then I'd still be finding one that is, and doing what I could to make that happen. To stay will require extreme discretion. Clue NO ONE ELSE in. Long term, it could become extremely burdensome. Don't let it wear on the relationship.

  4. Zach,

    Well, until you are ready to make whatever move you do, I would remain on the very down low about the cousin thing. You two are first cousins I assume? I'm wondering how nobody but two people know, unless you are further than first cousins. If you are further than first cousins, then you CAN get married there.

  5. Zach,

    Yeah, read them carefully. We're not lawyers, and don't give legal advice, but several of us have been there, done that.

    No matter what they say, they can always be amended, and/or visitation of children modified. That can happen smoothly, or it can be ugly. If there is joint custody involved, it could get tricky, as that would have to be modified. If you find work elsewhere, and explain to the Court that you have this opportunity you wish to take advantage of, and ask the Court to relieve you of your obligation to remain in the State, the judge may be inclined to do so. Situations change. The economy is changing. People are moving all over the place for work. If you are paying child support, the Court would want to see that continue. It WILL continue. If it is joint custody, without child support, you will most likely be looking at paying it going forward. If you are the custodial parent, whether your ex pays child support or not, (she, I assume, by your user name) will most likely try to gain custody. It could get ugly. Remember two things. "If it isn't on video, it didn't happen", and "nobody talks, everybody walks". Have no empirical evidence against you. Take full advantage of your 5th Amendment rights, if need be, or you are so inclined. (Which, incline yourself, if you are not already.) 

    Speaking of which, now that we've established there is at least one ex involved, how does she (again, I assume) feel about this relationship? As accepting as the parents? Or, have you been able to be so discrete as to keep it under wraps? 

  6. ........................... Can anyone help and point us in the right direction?

    Yup. Northwest, to Colorado. I would have to rehash the statutes, but, IIRC, Texas will NOT recognize it, they would consider it criminal incest, and COULD come after you. If you resided in another State, were legally married there, it still wouldn't matter, other than I doubt they would risk a case that could overturn the statute. However, they MIGHT be inclined to if you go elsewhere to specifically "skirt" the law, then return, thereby poking a finger in the eye of the State.

    If it were me, I'd be a looking for some new digs in say, Colorado or New Mexico. Not TOO terribly far away, but perfectly legal. You may think you don't have the money to move, but, you certainly don't have the money to fight needless court battles either. And, even if you don't (read CAN'T) get married there, in Texas, you're facing felony incest charges if perchance you have, shall we say "adult" relations. I'd be looking for a job in one of those two States, and lacing up my traveling shoes. I did an update of the State laws not long ago, so I'll copy/pasta what I found for you.



    Sec. 6.201. Consanguinity.

    A marriage is void if one party to the marriage is related to the other as:

    (1) an ancestor or descendant, by blood or adoption;

    (2) a brother or sister, of the whole or half blood or by adoption;

    (3) a parent's brother or sister, of the whole or half blood or by adoption;or

    (4) a son or daughter of a brother or sister, of the whole or half blood or by adoption.


    Sec. 25.02. PROHIBITED SEXUAL CONDUCT. (a) A person commits an offense if the person engages in sexual intercourse or deviate sexual intercourse with another person the actor knows to be, without regard to legitimacy:

    (1) the actor's ancestor or descendant by blood or adoption;

    (2) the actor's current or former stepchild or stepparent;

    (3) the actor's parent's brother or sister of the whole or half blood;

    (4) the actor's brother or sister of the whole or half blood or by adoption;

    (5) the children of the actor's brother or sister of the whole or half blood or by adoption; or

    (6) the son or daughter of the actor's aunt or uncle of the whole or half blood or by adoption.

    (B) For purposes of this section:

    (1) "Deviate sexual intercourse" means any contact between the genitals of one person and the mouth or anus of another person with intent to arouse or gratify the sexual desire of any person.

    (2) "Sexual intercourse" means any penetration of the female sex organ by the male sex organ.

    © An offense under this section is a felony of the third degree, unless the offense is committed under Subsection (a)(1), in which event the offense is a felony of the second degree.


    Sec. 1.103. PERSONS MARRIED ELSEWHERE. The law of this state applies to persons married elsewhere who are domiciled in this state.

    Added by Acts 1997, 75th Leg., ch. 7, Sec. 1, eff. April 17, 1997.

    In Subchapter C, Sec. 6.201. Consanguinity, I don't see first cousins specified, but, I am reasonably sure it has been added. Irregardless, under Incest

    Sec. 25.02. PROHIBITED SEXUAL CONDUCT, they ARE noted specifically, with no waiver for "legally married" there, or wherever. Which brings us to ("Skirting")

    Sec. 1.103. PERSONS MARRIED ELSEWHERE, where you will see, they could care less about THAT either.

    The best advice I personally can give you, is to move. Sorry. In this case, your parents acceptance is more than admirable, and their concerns are just as valid. Again, sorry I couldn't be the bearer of better news.

  7. Mikaela, 

    You've "Lazarused" this thread, but, perhaps it is a relevant topic of late. 

    I'm not with my cousin, and never will be. I've known this would be the case for many years now. However, we have got over the awkward of it, and enjoy what very infrequent face time we get. We let our youthful time together be very awkward for DECADES. We were estranged for many years. And yes, family functions which we both attended, while not often, were always awkward. We didn't go out of our way to avoid each other, but it always seemed we managed to avoid each other out of "awkward." I also think there was a subliminal reluctance to spend too much time together because we would be tempted to re-fire the shenanigans. Had we not waited until we were nearly 50 yrs old to reconnect and air it all out, we would have risked great heartache and carnage on our respective relationships. Unlike you, we don't regret what happened, just how we dealt with it. We do regret that we let it be awkward for all those years, but, as I said, it was probably for the best in the grand scheme of things.

    I do have an ex (well, 3 of them actually, LOL) which I don't see. The first one, it's just as well. The second one, meh, she wasn't too bad, and I actually call her "The Good Ex-wife" hahaha. The last one, I don't see, but, I'm not so sure its totally "just as well". While neither of us want to go back, we do have unfinished business. I actually had to forward some mail to her today, because we cannot manage to be in each others presence. It's a shame, but, it is what it is. The end started out amicably enough, but, as seems to always be the case, it got nasty before it got over. Maybe someday, we will be able to be civil enough to finish our business, and then, we can totally go our separate ways. Of course, if I get in the position I'm working toward, to where I can finish this business, she will most likely be quite willing to be civil for the 5 min. or so it would take to do so. She can be quite professional when the situation calls for it. Plus, as Denchim said, time does soften it. I was pretty jaded and a little more than p*ssed off when it all went south, but now, I know it is what it is, and there's no sense in holding on to the hard feelings and letting it eat away at me. There have been a couple little irritating incidents since the divorce, but, hey, 30 minutes later, I'd let it go. She'll do fine on her own, and I'm doing fine on my own.

    You don't mention the circumstances that lead you to this point, so, it's kind of hard to advise you beyond that. That you just have to give it time, and let the feelings diminish, and let it go. In time, you will be able to forgive and forget.

  8. hockey27,

    Since it is legal to marry your second cousin everywhere we know of, it's certainly fine in my book for the two of you to continue your relationship. I do hope the two of you are of age, considering your current level of neeked shenanigans, but other than that, go for it. If you two are happy together, then don't go back, and don't look back......

  9. Closetomydream, 

    Unlike quarter25, I AM quite the fan of beer. I am kinda picky about my beer though. I want to taste it. But, I don't want it too odd either. My beer of choice is Sam Adams Boston Lager. Before that, the one that got me off Busch in tight times and Michelob in good times, was one called Pete's Wicked Ale. I've not seen it in quite some time, and I don't think they make it any more. I was having one one evening, and a couple friends said "If you like that, you'll like Sam Adams". I had one, and was hooked.

    In this area, there are several vineyards/wineries. They do fests every so often, one of the bigger ones in the fall, called "ColorFest", when the leaves have changed. Over the last couple years, several breweries have opened up. There is now a "beer trail" like the wine trail. I've not been, but probably will at some point. I would probably only sample one at each place, because we would most likely be on the Harley. There was a time I wouldn't have worried so much about it, but, as I've gotten older, (and hopefully a little wiser) I don't like to drink too much on the bike. Anywhere here in town is within what I call "crawling distance", so, I'll get a little more carried away here. I just don't want to be half schnockered 40 miles from home, and try to ride with one hand over an eye back to town.

    There is a local watering hole the next town south of here, and the owner has contracted with Schlafly out of St. Louis, (http://schlafly.com/) to make a "house" beer, a brown ale, on tap. (They make an excellent pale ale they are most famous for.) When there, I have the brown ale. I occasionally like a good oatmeal stout. I'm not a big fan of Guinness, I'll have a Killian's Red on occasion. Most of the IPAs I've tried are a little too hoppy for me. Within about 3 miles, there use to be a microbrewery, and I nearly cried when it closed. They had excellent food, and probably about 10 different beers, any of which I could drink, but usually got their oatmeal stout or (Illinois) Lincoln Lager. The oatmeal stout was as good as any I've ever had. 

    I'd say if I ever do one of the fests as an event, I'll cage it, just to feel a little safer. The vineyards are where it's harder to moderate though, I've found. I'm not a huge fan of wine, but I've found a select few I like, and it's hard to stop at sharing one bottle with good food and good company.

  10. The Good Widow and I had a very nice ride of about 60 miles or so this evening too. We did the cemetery tour and put out the flowers on the graves of several of my friends. We got home just before it rained. Several of our friends are getting soaked at a local Italian Festival, where REO Speedwagon played. I know they started the concert, but I think they either canceled it, or put it off till the rain passed. FB has a bunch of pics of folks with a wet arse, LOL. This ole' goat saw the few flashes of lightning and put the Harley in the garage before we got ours wet too.  :wink:

  11. doi31,

    You are second cousins. Your Grandmothers are siblings, your parents are first cousins, and you two are second cousins.

    A common misconception is that you and his father are second cousins, (and him and your Mom would be too) but that is not the case. You and him are first cousins once removed to each other's respective parent. However, if it lessens any potential drama with the family, let them believe you two are third cousins.

  12. seema,

    He would then be your second cousin. We have a hard time nailing down the differences in the laws in the 50 United States. We here are generally clueless on the various Marriage Acts in India. However, If I have read it correctly, second cousins can LEGALLY marry. DO NOT quote me on this, you would have to read the Hindu Marriage Act. In it, first cousins in the North may not marry, but as is somewhat customary in the South, cross cousins can. Remember, this is first cousins, and your interest is your second cousin. That is why I think it is probably technically legal. However, as many find out, family may still have a major meltdown over it. If it were me, and it is legal, and it was what I wanted, I would get married, and let them have their meltdown........

  13. Uniquekiddo,

    I found this for you: http://www.everyculture.com/South-Asia/Nepali-Marriage-and-Family.html

    As I read it, it depends on your class and/or religion and/or ethnic group. If you're high caste Hindu, don't count on it being allowed. However, yours would be cross cousins, so, if any cousin marriage is allowed, that would be the type. As far as what the law actually says on the matter, this does not say. You would have to dig deeper. You seem quite well read and communicate well in English. From that, I will assume you have, are, or will attend a University. If so, check with their law school for an exact interpretation of the law. If it's legal, you may have to fight tooth and nail for this woman, but, if you feel it is worth it, do so.

  14. meomeo,

    You're 22. GET OUT OF THAT HOUSE. If your brother assaults you, by all means call the police. You don't mention where you are, but, I took the liberty of having a little peek. While you are not in the US, I'm pretty sure the police where you are would frown on his destruction of your property and physically assaulting you. He needs to be shown such behavior will not be tolerated.

    The same goes for your cousin. You don't mention what country she is in, and so far as I know, it doesn't really matter. If she is 19, and of age, and is being beaten by her family, she should report it to the police as well. Depending on the country and culture, not much may happen, or, there is the possibility they would be given their own beating. 

    Either way, YOU BOTH need to get out, and away from these people. Trust me, you love them more than they love you. You do not beat someone you love into submitting to your will. You beat someone into submission who is threatening or actually doing bodily harm. Me and my brothers can be pretty rowdy. Either of them now could probably take me eventually in a knock down drag out like we use to do when we were younger. But, they both know better than to come in my space and destroy my things. There would be no fair fight to it at that point. They know damned good and well I'd take a ball bat to them. That's because they're family. Anybody else does it, and I'll shoot them dead right there. You DO NOT have to put up with it, and you need to get out on your own NOW. Then, as soon as possible, you need to VERY QUIETLY, make arrangements for your cousin to join you. Second cousins, and beyond, are legal to marry everywhere we know of, so second cousins once removed are too. Your family is a sorely misinformed bunch of psychopaths. Where you are, FIRST cousins can marry, so you and her certainly can, without raising much of an eyebrow out of the legal system there. Once the two of you are married, you can jump through the hoops to have her become a citizen. If I have heard right, the government there has recently tightened up the rules for immigration. However, with proof of bodily harm, and a high likelihood of more should she return, she would probably be allowed in. Plus, being married would add to it. 

    You need to work out a way to communicate discretely, that cannot be snooped upon by either family, make your arrangements, and when you are ready, have her leave without a word. Here in the US, we have what are called trak phones. Not that they can be tracked, pretty much the opposite. Cheap, prepaid, basically disposable, cell phones. I would think where you are there would be something very similar. Where she is, maybe, maybe not, but, you need to find out. Where there is a will, there is a way. Go on the down low. Get yourself independent as soon as at all possible. Stay in contact as quietly as you can. Make your plans, and when you are ready, go for it, and don't let anyone stop you. If they come to your house, you have them arrested, and, if there is something along the order of what we call here, a restraining order, or order of protection, put one out on them. Then, if they show up, they go to jail. Eventually, they WILL leave you alone.

  15. Mick,

    Yeah, do like me and mine have done over 30 years later. You MUST be agreed that there will be no shenanigans. Much too much water has passed beneath the bridge, and there really is no going back. You risk a major trainwreck, with massive grief on the part of several other innocents if you do not come to this agreement.

    That said, me and mine did have a nice long convo one night, and aired it all out. Part of that was coming to an agreement that we do not have any stomach for cheating, so there would be no shenanigans. Air it out, without making it cumbersome or awkward. Admit it is a part of what makes you two who you are, you are not ashamed of what happened, and, in a different world, things may have been different. But, (as with us) the timing was just never right. Now, at this late date, and current lives, there is no going back to relive your youth. You will be walking a thin line, on thin ice. Don't fall.....

    I really think if me and mine had not been estranged until we were nearly 50 yrs old, there would have been times the temptation would have gotten the better of us. If I'm doing the math right, you're not quite as old as us, but close enough to know better than to go getting into something you WILL regret. Be very careful my friend.

  16. Rachel-Rae,

    If neither of you feel wrong about it, and it is perfectly legal where you are, go for it, and don't let anybody talk you out of it. If it were me, his mother's opinion would be the only one I would be concerned with. Because, really, what skin is it off of his Dad or anyone in his Dad's family?

    If you truly are soulmates, don't even consider the possibility of other partners. You will be asking for temptation and trouble that will seem mild compared to any potential family drama.

    I'm slightly confused. Do you still live with his parents, or in the same town/area? You will be moving to the city where he is, which is 6 hours from where his parents live? If so, follow your plan, and hearts. I see no real need to broadcast any particulars about your relationship. Take things as you would any normal relationship. If you are not comfortable, at least initially, being affectionate in front of family, then don't. But, be advised, it is VERY hard for people even 10 or more years your senior to hide such a relationship. It is virtually impossible for teens to do it. You two, being in your 20's, will fall somewhere between very hard and impossible. They will pick up on subtle hints. I don't recommend lying, but, I would recommend being discrete. It isn't their lives to live, or relationship to have. A simple "We enjoy spending our time together, so, that's what we do. If that makes us a "couple", then, I guess we're a couple. It isn't against the law, you know?" would be about as deep in it as I would go. Further questions would be met with "That seems like quite a forward question to ask" or something such as that. Of course, I'm usually a little more crude when asked nosy questions. I suppose that's why I don't get asked nosy questions much. Generally, my family doesn't ask nosy questions because they aren't sure they really want to know the answers. Mom quit prying LONG ago. I've broke the rest of them from asking. I think that in the grand scheme of things, you may have some drama, but, if you set your Aunt down for a nice heart to heart talk when and if this comes up, she'll come around. You simply tell her what you've told us. Tell her how much you appreciate all that they've done for you, that you don't want to loose their respect, and that you don't want her to think you came into it to cause trouble. Tell her that it's just a matter of sometimes not being able to choose who you fall in love with, and who your soulmate is. Sometimes it comes right out of the blue, it just feels so right, and you go with it. You may as well tell her that your only intention is to make her son happy for as long as you possibly can, too. Mom's have a tendency to place their son's happiness fairly high on their wish list.....

    Until it becomes an issue though, I wouldn't let it be an issue between the two of you. Even if some of the family does "disown" you two, it ISN'T the end of the world. There are members here, who've been "disowned" by some in their families, and have managed to do quite well for themselves. It is only the ones who disowned them who have had the loss. Adults leave the nest, and live their own lives. Many times, family does not agree with their choices. Most times, as I'm willing to bet would be the case in your case, they get over it, or at least get use to it. Take things slowly, keep it more on the down low if that's where your comfort level is, until your confidence grows to the point you fell more comfortable being ever so increasingly open. In your 20's, you've got plenty of time to work with, trust me, time is on your side.

  17. decentvirus,

    Actually, between second cousins, there is no appreciable increase in the risk of genetic problems of their offspring. So yes, there is a risk, BUT, it is the same as the general population. It is only among first cousins that the increased risk is known.

    As far as how you would convince the family, one thing would be to let them know that if YOU TWO so choose, you can go right ahead and LEGALLY get married, and there is nothing LAWFUL they can do to stop you. You would let them know their blessing is respectfully requested, but certainly not required...... Then, stand your ground.

  18. Alfonso61505,

    You rang?

    Well, if her father is your second cousin, then she is your second cousin once removed, and NOT your niece. However, having said that, I know where the sentiment comes from. I consider my second cousins' kids to be "nieces and nephews" of sorts, because we grew up so close, and consider each other the sisters we boys didn't have, and they consider us the brothers they didn't have.

    I also have a feeling you may not have a handle on the whole "once removed" thing. Very common. Is her father actually the first cousin of one of your parents? I ask because many people, when they first come here, and in society at large, consider the first cousin of a parent to be their second cousin. Actually, they are first cousins once removed. If her father is the first cousin of one of your parents, then, SHE is YOUR second cousin, NOT her father. Then again, you could have it figured out right, and she's your second cousin once removed. I also always say, that if everyone in the family thinks the first cousin once removed is actually the second cousin, then they would think she would be your THIRD cousin, and I'd not tell them any different. If they find out that second cousins can marry,  then how could they say (other than these foolish biases, even as we have here in the U.S.) that third cousins couldn't? My exact saying is "If that's what they think, roll with it!!!" 

    Either way, second cousins and beyond are perfectly legal to marry everywhere we know of here on this site. There is some resistance CULTURALLY in some Asian countries out to several more generations, but legally, we know of nowhere that second cousins and beyond cannot marry. You didn't mention it, so I shan't either, but, as a Mod, I did take the liberty of checking where you are. Not your actual street address mind you, only what State or Country you are in. If my look-up is correct, you are in a country where first cousins can't marry. India is about the only place I can think of that is worse about it. BUT, you aren't first cousins, and if her Dad IS your second cousin, then legally, even where you are, the two of you should be able to have whatever relationship you choose to, up to and including marriage, if you so choose. I would have to dig a little deeper to find  that out for sure, but, I'm reasonably certain of it.

    I don't particularly recall my advice to italy21, and don't really have the time to go check it out. My best advice to you is, let us know the exact relation you are, and we'll go from there. I would also encourage you to have her set down with you and check out this site together. I think she needs to see it too.

    Let's figure out your exact relationship, have her check this out, and we'll try to convince her to not rule out a relationship because of the cultural bias against it. Her parents may flip their wigs initially, but I have a feeling eventually, they would get over it. Especially, if they knew that legally, you two could get married if you choose. 

  19. Starcrossed,

    Well, if you're a "total stoner hippy" then you're probably approaching the level I use to maintain. Just don't be surprised if one day when you're around 40ish, you wake up and think "Damn, I just realized I don't smoke like I use to..." For me, it pretty much was defining though. And, it certainly distracted me from my studies. Cuz (and all of us in both our circles really) were pretty much defined by it. However, she apparently used it as you are, because it didn't distract her from her studies. She stayed focused, I got bored. I was tired of school. Dumb move on my part. I've done ok for myself, but I would have done much better had I stayed the course I had laid out. Live and learn I suppose. That's why I ALWAYS tell our younger members to keep their noses in the books, and get an education. I hope your Cuz is doing so too. Work on the relationship repair thing, and take it from there. Eventually, who knows. Things could turn out for you. It hasn't gotten to where it is overnight, so, it's liable to take considerable time for a major change. Luckily for you, you are young enough, time IS on your side.....

  20. Starcrossed,

    Opposites can attract. Look at James Carville and Mary Matalin. I suppose they've learned how to avoid fiery pillow talk. I don't see how you and Cuz could be further apart politically than those two.

    As far as the religious considerations, unless you are Hindu, (and there is reasonable doubt the texts of that religion actually prohibit the practice) you're pretty much good to go. All Christian denominations allow for first cousin marriage, provided it's legal in the State you reside in. The Jewish religion allows it, and, as is the case in the Muslim religion, it is sometimes preferred.

    I'm going to venture a guess here that you are Christian of some persuasion or another. You ARE liable to find a strong CULTURAL bias against the practice, but you will certainly find no SCRIPTURAL prohibition against it. Should you look, and challenge any nay-sayers to do so as well, you will find multiple instances where cousins were COMMANDED by God to marry. Now, if you are Catholic, you would have to get a dispensation from the Diocese, but that's no big deal, and as a rule, only a small "donation" fee. One good thing about that if you ARE Catholic, is, that once the Diocese approves it, you can pretty much forget worrying what family will say, because if they are that devout, they won't argue with the Diocese. Period. If you are of a Protestant denomination, you may have to "school" the pastor on the Scriptures a little. It don't mean it will change his, or anyone else's mind, it would only prove you were right to look deeper outside that particular persuasion. Let me be very clear on this. NO CHRISTIAN PASTOR CAN LEGITIMATELY CLAIM SCRIPTURE AS A REASON FIRST COUSINS CANNOT MARRY. PERIOD. The same for a Rabbi, but rabbis know better. We have resources here that back that up. http://www.cousincouples.com/?page=religion Way out in front of where you are at this point, but, things to consider in deciding where you want to go from here.

    Now, to possible bigger fish than those for you to fry. It seems that at least from the time of her parents' passing, and subsequent joining of your household, this tension between the two of you has flourished. Understandable at a tender age, with you being who you were in the pecking order, and her having went through the trauma of loosing her parents. But, at some point, does it not behoove you to break this cycle of hostility of sorts you have fallen into over the years? Regardless of whether she shares your feelings or not, I think you should be telling her these insights of yours on how the relationship has (d)evolved to this state of bickering that leaves these hurt feelings. And, that personally, you don't like it, and think it should change. Part of such a conversation could very well go to what we here call "The old tried and true" "If you weren't my cousin, _______" line. Something like "You know, even though we fight like siblings, we aren't, but I think, if you weren't my cousin, you'd be pretty much right for me. I'm obviously not doing too good at picking them so far..." You know, wing it in the moment. You'll think of what to say in the moment if you've carefully and honestly thought out what you want to tell her. If it were me, I might would toss that out there just to gauge her reaction, but it would still be a small part of a much bigger "be nice" talk you two really need to have, it sounds like. Outdoorsy, self-reliant, and thoughtful as needed? Yeah, you need to work on fixing this bridge Bub. Who knows, maybe she's waiting on the right moment to express the same feelings as you, but doesn't want to be the one breaking the ice.

    As far as the alcohol and weed, you may as well grow out of it now. I still drink, and, more than I should probably on occasion. I don't like to do it to the point of being out of control though. No good has ever come of me getting out of control. I don't do it anymore. Back in the day, I probably smoked more weed in a week than you have in your life. No more than you are expressing you're that into it, I'd certainly feel safe in saying on my "best" month, you've not outdone me yet, LOL. I never thought I'd "grow out of it" like I was told I would. But, you know what? I did. If I were to try to do that again, I'd be a slobbering zombie setting in the corner drooling on myself. Can't do it. Can't do it because of my work, and call me an old fogy, but I can't do it and maintain anymore. Sucks getting old, but it happens to the best of us. May as well get that part out of your system now. Consider it fun had, and move on. You can do it now, or you can waste more $$$ on it, and do it eventually anyhow. You decide. 

    Just my $.02 from out here in the cheap seats......   

  21. Lucy,

    He isn't just a user here, ColoradoMarried is and admin. He's generally a pretty busy boy, but he pops in from time to time. He is married to his first cousin, and indeed, DID (obviously) do so in Colorado. It is perfectly legal to do so there..... He is also pretty partial to advising cousin couples to locate there and marry.

    There may be a question on the application about any relationship, and if there is, you simply put "first cousins" in the blank. That does NOT disqualify you from getting a marriage license. If the clerk says it does, they are wrong, and you should ask to speak to someone further up the food chain.

    If it would be helpful, copy the statute and have it on hand when you go. http://www.cousincouples.com/info/statelaws.htm#CO You're only interested in the first part, Title 14.

  22. LoopyLea,

    It would depend on if both of you are unattached, and available first off. If you both are available, and, I'm going to assume, of age, then text him. Just something short, to let him know you were thinking of him, and wondering how he's been. You don't have to bring up "that" night, or anything that happened. In fact, until you determine his "availability" status, you really shouldn't mention it.

    I'm going to also assume you've looked around the site here, and probably realize, (or should) that you really have nothing to be scared or guilty about. In mentioning Boxing Day, I'll also assume you (and him too) are from Canada. As a mod, I can have a peek, to check, but, I really don't have time to do so right now. At any rate, in Canada, it is perfectly legal to pursue a relationship with your cousin, up to and including marriage, if it should ever go to that level.

    As for now, take it slow, just text him, with something simple, and see what happens. Start out with "Hey, how are you doing. You just popped in my head, and I thought I'd drop you a line to check on you." If he's available, he may bring the topic up as your conversations progress, (if they progress) and save you the trouble of bringing it up. By the same token, he may have also sobered up the next morning, had the exact same feelings as you, decided to not let it get complicated or awkward, and avoided you, like you have him, for all the same reasons. Until you break the ice, and contact him, you'll never know. If the conversation goes good, you progress to talking on the phone. It's harder, but better, (short of actual face time) to hear it than just read it. You don't have to bring the past up, but maybe ask when he's going to be in town again, and mention that you'd like to have a little of that face time, because you miss seeing him. The truth, isn't it? It isn't too forward to say something along those lines, but, it does leave him room to agree.

    What will you do if you find out he feels the same way? Do you feel strongly enough about him to get over the "cousin" factor, and consider a relationship of some sort? And what of all of this travel he does? Is an ongoing LDR going to be an issue for you? Can you settle for seeing him when you can?

  23. LordRhobar,

    My first impression from the tale you've told, and how it has unfolded over these last few months, is, that there is a possibility this crush is on YOU. Have you considered that? What if she's had the same feelings toward you for as long as you've had them toward her, and she's too shy to say it, more less act upon it?

    I recommend staying close, and enjoying what face time you can get out of her. I would stop texting her though. Kinda like "telephone tag." She's it. When you appear to go into "ignore mode", it could draw her out. Do the little flirty thing if you want to, but face to face and candidly only, and certainly nothing over the top with it. Drop a flirty little line, then walk away. See if she makes the effort to have a comeback. If she's as shy as you say, she may be considerably more nervous about what people would say than you are, and therefore trying to ignore her attraction to you.

    Of course, all of this is dependent on if this crush of hers IS actually on you. I'm calling at least a 50/50% chance it is, from out here in the cheap seats....

  24. Leane,

    What he is to you is totally unrelated. At least by blood. The lady is the wife of your dad's first cousin, so, his "cousin-in-law". Like sister-in-law, only cousins. Her brother is the brother-in-law of you dad's first cousin. His son would be your dad's cousin's nephew, but only through his marriage to the lady, not blood. He would only be the lady's biological nephew, not the nephew of anyone on your side of the family. Anyone who would give you grief over him being YOUR cousin somehow is a fool. Pay no attention to such foolishness.

    Even if he was the son of your dad's cousin, and the lady, he would then be, by blood, your second cousin. Second cousins are legal everywhere we know of. If your dad's cousin and the lady have kids, then the young man in question would be THEIR first cousin, but, still, totally unrelated to you. It reminds me of a humorous saying I've quoted here a couple times, made by a guy I use to work with in Kentucky once. We asked him what he was doing one weekend we had off, and his reply was, and I quote:"Oh, we're going over to see my uncle's brother's sisters' kids and them."  :shocked: Whut? "You know, my uncle's brothers' sisters' kids and them..." OOOOOKKKKK Dave, as long as you've got it figured out.  :huh:  :laugh:

    So, provided you are both of age, or keep the physical to an age appropriate level, carry on, and nip the drama in the bud with the information provided here....

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