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Jordan Colbert

how do I convince my cousin that we are not doing anything wrong by wanting to get married?

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Our story started roughly 2 years ago when my cousin confessed she had feelings for me. At the time she said this is wrong and we should not be doing this. But we continued developing our relationship anyway. We planned of our lives together after marriage, babies, places to visit, things to do and so on. We lived a happy life. Now after two years of constant back and forth of; this is wrong we should not be doing it and it’s ok let’s go ahead with it, she wants to end the relationship but isn’t doing it, just putting a halt to the boyfriend/girlfriend aspect and just wants to be friends. She says, “I should have been the adult in the room. I don’t want to continue doing wrong.” She feels that when we inform our family about our intentions we will end up creating a huge and permanent split in our family. We will be the reason for our family to break apart. People will hate us. Previously at the beginning of our relationship she had said that she doesn’t care about what other people think of her. When I brought this up she said well I do care now. I tried convincing her that I’ll deal with all the heat from the family, you can even say he is the one pushing for it I’m not that interested. I’ll be able to make the family come to terms with us. But she still says even if you convince the family I know it’s wrong and my mind will not be at ease. She says even if we get married I won’t be able to live a happy life because I’ll be disturbed about the fact that we are cousins and we shouldn’t be married. Also whenever she sees other cousins they remind her that we are doing wrong. She feels bad when she sees them. Sometimes she says that I look like her brother and that makes it difficult for her. The thing I don’t understand is that these are issues that were there during the first year of our relationship, why are they becoming unbearable now. She was able to put these thoughts aside then. Why can’t she now? I asked her do you want to end our relationship? Her reply was, “Yes, sometimes I want to end it. But sometimes I don’t. I don’t know.” I said why don’t you end it then. She said, “You’ve done nothing but loved me. And that’s why it’s difficult for me to end it. I’m thinking about our relationship in a realistic way and you think in a hopeful way. There is no way our family will allow us to be together.” 

I feel that if I can convince her that we are not doing anything wrong. We love each other and there’s nothing wrong about it, she might change her mind. The thing is I’ve tried everything I could to do that. But she doesn’t accept it. I’ve given her examples of cousin marriages happening for so many decades. Her response is that if people have been doing wrong that doesn’t mean we continue doing wrong. 

You may think she does not love me anymore and is trying to find excuses to end our relationship. That’s not how it is. She is a tough independent woman. She does not let other people’s opinions play any role in her decision making. She thinks for herself and sticks to her decisions however painful they may be. I know her very well. She still loves me. Just not enough to marry me. 

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I wonder what ages you are now, and when she confessed feelings. It sounds like maybe she is somewhat older, because you said she said "i should have been the adult".

You can't "make" her be ok with the entire situation. Because even though it may not be wrong for cousins to marry... that doesn't make it easy to deal with all the blowback from family & friends. And there will be plenty.

Hopefully the 2 of you can have enough open discussion to come to a mutual decision, and proceed from there.

Have you thought about asking her to read some of the success stories posted on here?

 

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1 minute ago, Ken said:

It sounds like maybe she is somewhat older

We are both adults. Yes she is older to me. But we have discussed that fact and age is not a matter for us.

6 minutes ago, Ken said:

You can't "make" her be ok with the entire situation.

I just want to find a way to convince her that cousins getting married is not something wrong.

2 minutes ago, Ken said:

Have you thought about asking her to read some of the success stories posted on here?

I fear that if I direct her to this website she will not even open the link. I think it might even make things worse (I may be wrong).

 

Thanks

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Yes, it could be a risk to show her this site.

Do you spend a lot of time together?

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Just now, Ken said:

Do you spend a lot of time together?

Yes we do. We talk everyday. Another factor that must be mentioned is that we do not live in the same country. We visit each other during vacations.

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6 minutes ago, Jennifer Tang said:

Does your family know about this relationship? I'm sure this is really hard for you.

No, none of our family members know about this. However, I think they do suspect what’s going on. But they don’t want to say anything. Cuz if they say it, it will be a huge mess. 

Just one closest friend of each one of us knows. Yes it is terrible, specially after seeing wonderful days. 

Edited by Jordan Colbert

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ok, you asked me to read this, and i have. and there are a couple of things here...

first off, the cultural perceptions may have a lot to do with this. you're in different countries, but you give any clues as to where. if it's anywhere in western civilization, the cultural perceptions are going to be the same... doesn't matter if you're talking about australia or canada or europe or america, it's the same.  but there are some cultures in the middle east that have much more positive views of cousin marriage, and then there are asian cultures that have a very dim view of cousins. if she's from an asian culture, you're unlikely to ever convince her.

what exactly is it that she thinks is wrong about it? is it a genetic concern? a moral/biblical concern? or is it just the "what others will say" kind of thing?

it might be that the only way to convince her is to enlist the aid of someone in the family to the case in favor of the two of you. i know, nobody knows. but you said you think many family members suspect but are not saying anything to avoid a mess. 

let me tell ya something. if you think they suspect, then they KNOW. and if they're not saying anything about it, it is NOT to avoid a mess. they're just respecting your privacy. seriously, people who suspect things like this and disapprove aren't going to give a second's thought to how messy it will get if THEY confront you. they're going to be in way too big a rush to get all in your face to tell you what a mess YOU are making. that's just human nature.

so you need to go to one of those who suspect that you trust and admire, and that you know SHE will trust, and tell them what's going on. because it sounds to me like the only "wrong" your cousin is seeing is through what she thinks is the eyes of people she's afraid to lose. and if she can get the assurance that they aren't going to judge her, then maybe she'll start to see your relationship as  right.  

 

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15 minutes ago, LadyC said:

let me tell ya something. if you think they suspect, then they KNOW. and if they're not saying anything about it, it is NOT to avoid a mess. they're just respecting your privacy. seriously, people who suspect things like this and disapprove aren't going to give a second's thought to how messy it will get if THEY confront you. they're going to be in way too big a rush to get all in your face to tell you what a mess YOU are making. that's just human nature.

Yes! Exactly. :)I love it! :)

 

Jordan,

I like to ask: If she does not want to get married, then why are you too concerned about it? I asked it because I translate what she said to I don't want to get married now. She admits that you have done nothing to her but love her. You have been good to her; hence, she got no reason in breaking up with you. You know what you should do? Ignore this thing with her. Just love her and do what you are doing. :D You don't need to convince your girlfriend, man... She's gonna be fine. lol :D And besides, I feel like you aren't ready to be married anyways -- even though you said that both of you guys are adults. I take that you guys are at most in your early 20s, am I right? So I mean, what's the rush!?

 

Anyhow, good thing that you explained yourself in your post because everytime I see this

On ‎5‎/‎21‎/‎2018 at 1:54 PM, Jordan Colbert said:

...she wants to end the relationship but isn’t doing it, just putting a halt to the boyfriend/girlfriend aspect and just wants to be friends

My immediate theory is that she is seeing somebody else! And that she kinda want to have a safe landing before jumping ships... But having said that, and I felt that I don't think there's any third party involved here, can you confirm nonetheless that there aren't any? You see, for cousin relationships, one of the toughest of it is its normality. If your girlfriend finds that seeing other guys are more acceptable in her family and whatnot, and the other guy is equally or greater than you are, then you are in a host of trouble. I don't sense this in your post, though... but it will be good if you can confirm. TY. :D

 

 

 

Pooch

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1 hour ago, LadyC said:

you asked me to read this, and i have

Dear LadyC,

Thank you very much for reading this and giving me time. 

I am from Pakistan and her family left Pakistan for USA 20 years ago.

She does not consider the biblical aspect of it. She just says it’s morally wrong and also is concerned what others will see. I told her there is nothing morally wrong about it there are a lot of cousins that are married in the world. She says if others are doing wrong that doesn’t mean we should also do wrong. I also told her that when others see that you are happy with me they will be OK with us being together. But she says that I still feel that it is wrong and none of your facts change the way I feel. She says I have a gut feeling that it is wrong and I think I should go with my gut. 

I think getting a family member involved is a good idea. Thank you for that. I’ll talk to her about it. She did mention once that she fears that her family will disown her. She also mentioned that she was thinking how she will introduce me to her friends as a cousin or as a significant other. And when they know that I am her cousin they will be disgusted with her. I told her that once your friends know that you are happy in this relationship they will be happy for you and won’t think bad of you. She says that our relationship has become toxic and she is tired of having to fight with all these negative thoughts and wants to end our relationship. She says if she lives her life with me she will always be thinking of this as wrong and will not be able to live a happy life that she will be a lifeless person.

She says she still loves me and will always love me but being with me she cannot have a peace of mind because she says that she cannot put aside these negative feelings and she thinks that they will consume her and destroy her mental state if she pursues a life with me.

I think I just need to find a way to make her feel differently about this. I think that the best way to do that is to show her my love for her and to love her more and more. However she already loves me and she knows that I love her beyond bounds so maybe I need to try something else to change her feelings. 

Thanks.

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Dear pooch,

1 hour ago, pooch said:

If she does not want to get married, then why are you too concerned about it?

She wants to end any possible future between us. She said that even when we end she will still continue to love me. But she cannot be with me because she will not have a peace of mind. She will be always thinking she is doing wrong. 

1 hour ago, pooch said:

And besides, I feel like you aren't ready to be married anyways -- even though you said that both of you guys are adults. I take that you guys are at most in your early 20s, am I right?

I am in my early 20s and I am in no rush to get married however she is in her early 30s and she needs to find someone in her life.

1 hour ago, pooch said:

My immediate theory is that she is seeing somebody else! And that she kinda want to have a safe landing before jumping ships... But having said that, and I felt that I don't think there's any third party involved here, can you confirm nonetheless that there aren't any?

Knowing her and how she lives her life I do not believe she is seeing someone else. I may be wrong but I don’t think she could do that. She has admitted to me that she believes no one else can love her the way I do. So I don’t think she believes that there is another guy equal or greater than me. The only problem she has with me is that I am her cousin.

Thanks. 

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@Jordan Colbert

I hate to say it, but I think you are having to work way too hard to "make" this work. You are trying to control something that can't be controlled... someone else's feelings.

If you are in Pakistan, and she is in US... who is willing to relocate? How does that part of it work out?

Maybe you need to take a step back and re-evaluate. Keep loving her, but give her a little room to breathe. And you take a deep breath as well. It has to be a solid decision from both of you, equally. Not so much pressure from you to "get her" to see it the way you do.

It hurts me to hear you say she feels she will not be at peace inside if she takes the next step with you. That is a big deal!

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1 hour ago, Jordan Colbert said:

Dear pooch,

She wants to end any possible future between us. She said that even when we end she will still continue to love me. But she cannot be with me because she will not have a peace of mind. She will be always thinking she is doing wrong. 

I am in my early 20s and I am in no rush to get married however she is in her early 30s and she needs to find someone in her life.

Knowing her and how she lives her life I do not believe she is seeing someone else. I may be wrong but I don’t think she could do that. She has admitted to me that she believes no one else can love her the way I do. So I don’t think she believes that there is another guy equal or greater than me. The only problem she has with me is that I am her cousin.

Thanks. 

Oh my oh my.. :( 

You are in trouble bro.. Prepare for a heartache.

So here's how I see it bro: You are in LDR, with a girlfriend of less than 5 years, she being in her early 30s looking for a man, about 10 years age gap, you haven't have your life together (yet), her being your cousin, and family disapproves potentially. 

You have been together for two years. I suggest you should stop this relationship bro. Do you see yourself marrying this girl? Maybe you do...but she doesn't. She does not love you bro. Dang, I really hate saying to a guy that the girl she loves does not love him coz that hurts...it really hurts. :( I mean, if she loves you, she will say something like, "Do I have a future with you?" or "What about us?" or "How can I help (in investing) in this relationship?" or "I want to go back to Pakistan" or "I will arrange a visa for you to come here in US" or anything along those lines.... But what do I hear?

Let's just be freaking friends..

What the freaking hell dude. Ouch. You see, when you said this,

1 hour ago, Jordan Colbert said:

She has admitted to me that she believes no one else can love her the way I do.

Well... Maybe. But the jury is still out. I would even say that I only believe her 30%. The answer "she believes no one else can love her the way I do" is only true 30%. Mark that. The jury is still out. I mean, you say that she is early 30 right? Say a doctor or a lawyer approached her at work or something and introduced himself. A guy with a 6-figure income looking like Fawad Khan or Imran Abbas or any combination of those. Dude, you got no chance. None. By the way, what does your friends say? 

She will definitely reconsider things even though she won't admit it. She will say that she loves you (of course this is true because she does not hate you but it does not mean she still likes you like 2 years ago when you guys both hit it off you know...?) but at the back of her mind, she wants to get rid of you bro..  Ouch. Well, probably not "get rid off" because that's way to harsh.. Just you know, she would want that you don't love her anymore and chase her and be all of that and stuff. :(

I bet that if she founds out that you are seeing other girls, or cheated or whatnot, she will even be happier (to some extent). She may hate you for 1 week but be happy for the rest of her life coz now "she is free"...You know what I'm saying? Now you said,

1 hour ago, Jordan Colbert said:

So I don’t think she believes that there is another guy equal or greater than me. The only problem she has with me is that I am her cousin.

No no no no no......

Not the way it works. There's a guy equal or greater than you bro. Your job is "put a fence around her". lol. So that there are no "bad guys" that will make moves to her. She is in her 30s and there are lots of guys circling around her like vultures. Now I may be extreme in saying this but about 2 years ago, I wouldn't even be surprised if her inbox is full from text messages from guys who want to have a date with her. It just so happened that you are the "nice guy", who lives from a different planet never to see what she is doing, and so she has you as her back up boyfriend...and there you are, giving your heart and affection to this woman who may or may not love you.

I mean, everything is going in this direction. You guys are in a fight and being in LDR these fights can blow up exponentially. You know what I am saying? I have been to in one with my cousin in the period of our relationship so trust me, I know. But when your cousin-gf says this,

1 hour ago, Jordan Colbert said:

She says that our relationship has become toxic and she is tired of having to fight with all these negative thoughts and wants to end our relationship. She says if she lives her life with me she will always be thinking of this as wrong and will not be able to live a happy life that she will be a lifeless person.

This is game over for her bro. It just so happened that she does not hate you that's why she is not breaking up with you....yet. But it's only a matter of time. Either she will give in to some temptation and cheat on you (if she hasn't been cheating on you already) or that she will grow tired of this situation and dump you on the side. What I suggest is be a man and confront her through skype or videocam, talk for 2 hours, cry together, and end it once and for all. "Pull the plug" on this comatose relationship man...At least when you do it this way, it will be mutual...there will be no feeling of who dump who or who hurt who. You cannot change the feeling of the girl bro. Now that's my real answer.

Now of course I assume a lot of things above and I believe that you know her more than I do... but come on man.. you have to admit,, that there's some truth on my post at the very least.

 

 

Pooch

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I realize that this is not an ideal situation. I’m only trying to make this work because I believe she is just going through a phase and just needs to be convinced.

11 hours ago, Ken said:

You are trying to control something that can't be controlled... someone else's feelings.

I don’t want to control her feelings. I just wish I could convince that it will be ok. 

11 hours ago, Ken said:

Maybe you need to take a step back and re-evaluate

Giving her time and space means ending all communication with her and losing her forever. 

11 hours ago, Ken said:

who is willing to relocate?

Either one of us can shift. 

12 hours ago, Ken said:

It hurts me to hear you say she feels she will not be at peace inside if she takes the next step with you. That is a big deal!

She is just putting up walls and trying to justify leaving me. She is just over exaggerating the whole peace of mind thing. She had the same feelings when we started our relationship and it wasn’t a problem for 1 and a half years.

Dear @pooch Thank you! You have given me a very realistic picture however I still want to go ahead even if 0.01% chance. It is very discouraging but I don’t want to regret later in my life that I did not take the chance however small it may be. I'll will with with her in a couple of days to spend the summers with her. I hope and pray we can sort things out. I admit there maybe some truth to your post, I am just hopeful that it won't be the case.

Thanks.

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On 5/21/2018 at 4:06 PM, Jordan Colbert said:

we do not live in the same country. We visit each other during vacations.

How many times have you two visited, and how long typically? Are you meaning just a few weeks each year? Or are there some longer visits? 

Has it been an intimate relationship when you visit each other? Or???

You initially said she confessed feelings 2yrs ago, and you two planned out your life together, and "lived a happy life"... but you also said "2yrs of back-&-forth".

I'm just trying to figure out how much time you two have had together, in person, and what the relationship is like when together every day. Do you stay with other family on your vacation visits? Or do you have some one-on-one visits?

I can't imagine how difficult it would be to have such a long distance relationship, unless there are a lot of personal visits.

Edited by Ken

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7 hours ago, Jordan Colbert said:

Dear @pooch Thank you! You have given me a very realistic picture however I still want to go ahead even if 0.01% chance. It is very discouraging but I don’t want to regret later in my life that I did not take the chance however small it may be. I'll will with with her in a couple of days to spend the summers with her. I hope and pray we can sort things out. I admit there maybe some truth to your post, I am just hopeful that it won't be the case.

Thanks.

Well....Fair enough.

I said my piece bro. I cannot add anything more.

Early this year, I read in the news that there was a 15-year old boy who fell from Man Wah Building in Hongkong. The dude survived a 19-story fall. Crazy, eh? Now guess what, even though he survived, I bet $1,000,000 that if I ask you to jump from 19-story building given that this kid survived the fall, you will say to me, "Pooch get the hell outta here".. ?

Now here's my point: If you want to risk your heart, your affection, your tears, your money, your time, your effort, your masculinity, your love, your ego, and your pride to this 0.01% chance, it's all on you bro...

It's all on you. Not on the girl. Not on me, Pooch. Not on God. Not on any prophet. Not on anybody... It's gonna be all on you.

You will come back to this thread and I will tell you after you are back here licking your wounds, "I told you so"....

 

Pooch

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    • By MadMax007
      Hello all, thanks for stopping by. First off, thanks for all the great advice, stories, and posts on here, and special thanks to the creators and admins. This has been bugging me for a while, and I was so glad to discover this place, I really felt welcomed and moved by some of these stories, but most of all, hopeful. I truthfully am a forum noob, and have never really posted anything on a public board before, much less this topic. The reason I started this topic is because most of the threads I came across seemed geared to very young people, and while other posts did offer some insight, I decided to try my luck here, hoping for a more custom tailored response, respectably. 
      Straight to the goods then. I'm 'Andy' and soon to be 35, she's ‘Cindy’, in her 40s, and we are both single and 1st cousins. I have had a crush on her as far back as I can remember, our families were close when we were kids, and often spent weekends together. Because of our age gap at the time, her being a rebel teen who idolized Madonna and me with my Transformers and GI Joes, we were not very close. We hung out like average cousins, nothing special. Over the years she was always close to my thoughts, plus we stayed in touch on social media, but again noting special. Fast forward a little over two decades, during which we would occasionally see each other at large family gatherings, but no major contact beyond that. Next time, it was special, it felt different. Recently, for an outdoor family reunion, it just so happened that we were seated together and we practically spent the whole time chatting exclusively. I really love to make her laugh and I was doing just that, and so was she. Every now and then I'd get from her, what was probably a wholly innocent gesture, an arm touch and smile. I still refuse to read too much into this, this is uncharted waters and I know better than to treat it like the average crush. At one point during the party, a relative approached us and exclaimed to my cousin Cindy, "oh my, I thought this man was your boyfriend!" Our mutual relative was a little surprised when she realized it was me, but did not make a big deal or read too much into it. This made me back off, obviously my body language or a combination of ours both suggested we were a couple to anyone who did not know better. Cindy's reaction was amazing though, smiles and blush galore, she didn't even make an "Eww face" at the remark. Anyway, since then we have been texting occasionally, every other day, very short conversations because I know she is busy and a single mother. I remember one text she wrote, "I miss you." We exchange our problems and offer advice. On more than one occasion she mentioned how she just wants to be with a nice guy who accepts her, and how hard it is for her to find someone, I responded truthfully, that I'm pretty much in the same situation, looking for "Miss Right" and all that. We even spoke on the phone briefly, this is where it escalates a tiny bit.
      Here is where it gets good, but really scary for me. This Saturday we have a date, for lack of a better word, or more accurately dinner and a movie. Yup, I went for it and she said yes! Holy holy crap! What do I do? I kind of have the evening planned, dinner at a nice restaurant, but I'm hoping to sub the movie with something romantic, like somewhere with a nice view of the city. I really just want to talk with her and spend time alone, and gauge her feelings a bit more. Anyway, I am out of my element here. I'm hoping someone reading this has been in a similar position. I am totally patient and would rather something happen organically on her end, than me trying to force it and be selfish. I would love tips for our date though, I will be myself of course, but I’m wondering if there’s little things I could say or do to hint at my romantic interest in her. I'm kind of nervous and don't want to make a fool of myself. 
      I have strong feelings for Cindy. She's amazing in terms of her fortitude, strength, and outlook on life. She is beautiful inside and out, she makes me laugh, and is always on my mind lately. A part of me believes we don't choose who we fall in love with, and it's not often a girl makes me feel this way. There's definitely some magic there, I just can't tell if its of the romantic kind or not. 
      Any advice from people who have been in similar situations, and my age group would be preferred, but all thoughts are greatly appreciated. Thank you kindly in advance!
       
      Andy
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